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New container cargo income rating?

 
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Container income rating in $/ton or $/TEU ?
All $/ton
6%
 6%  [ 1 ]
All $/TEU
12%
 12%  [ 2 ]
Both at once.
56%
 56%  [ 9 ]
Either one, optional.
25%
 25%  [ 4 ]
Total Votes : 16

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Olle P
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 7:05 am    Post subject: New container cargo income rating? Reply with quote

After running my container ships for more than two years, I've only reached maximum tonnage once, whereas I normally run with all volume (TEUs) occupied.
In the charter lists all container freights are rated by $/ton although $/TEU would normally (for me) be a lot more appropriate to calculate best profit.
Recalculating the profit for each potential cargo does get a bit tedious...

My first thought was to suggest to have income rated in both ways for all cargos, but that would require an extra column in the list that allready span too wide for my comfort.
My preferred option is to be able to switch between the two by a keystroke, although I'm aware it might take some work to implement.
Second option is to have the freight rated in $/TEU.

What do you guys think?

/Olle
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Novex
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 7:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Could be nice and this could safe some calculation time, from time to time Exclamation

Note:
Some container vessels have a low DWT/TEU factor (The amount of tons you can load per TEU). If this factor is low you’ll not be able to fit the complete TEU capacity on board for heavy cargo types, like all metals… I have this problem sometimes when there are no other good loads available. In this case $/ton would be nice, so only $/TEU is not an option form me…

Cheers, Novex
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Jocke
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 7:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

I like your suggestion and voted on "Both at once". But the best solution for me would be to choose rate depending on what kind of ship to load, unless POC could regognize what cargo to load and switch between ton and teu's.

Regards Jocke
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Olle P
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 7:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Novex wrote:
Some container vessels have a low DWT/TEU factor...
I realise that much, but haven't bothered nor had time to figure out the average DWT/TEU factor for ships and tons/TEU for freights.

The observations I have done suggest that metals and machinery are typically high density with a fairly low $/ton rating, whereas agricultural products are low density with a higher $/ton rating.

/Olle
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Novex
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 15, 2004 8:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Olle wrote:
The observations I have done suggest that metals and machinery are typically high density with a fairly low $/ton rating, whereas agricultural products are low density with a higher $/ton rating.

Yes, you’re right indeed, but I just mentioned this because, when I’ve a lot of vessels in the game, I sometime have to settle with a heavy load and low payment… in this case don’t take away the #/Ton option and only add or combine a $/TEU option like you suggest. This is a good idea and I hope RDK will take a look at it.

Cheers, Novex
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Olle P
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2004 8:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now I did the maths (DWT/TEU) for all container ships up to 1989:
- In a class of it's own is Transindiana, with a capacity of 60 tons/TEU.
- Second is Hakone Maru, at 34.3.
- Then comes a handful at about 25, amongst others the Castillo de Lopera cold freighter, at 25.9.
- Most are between 15 and 20. Here we find the often used Frankfurt Express (16.9), Nuernberg Express (15.7) and Hamburg Express (16.5).
- Worst off is Hyundai Prim at 11.8.

So what about the cargoes?
I did some calculations of a few random samples for common goods:
- Machinery: typical about 25, maxing about 30. (five samples)
- Fish: Just over 10. (four samples)
- Agricultural pruducts: 9.5-11.5 (four samples)
- NF-metals: 24-28. (six samples)
- Chemical liquids: 19.2 (one sample only)
- Textiles: 10-15 (four samples)
- Plastic: 17.5 (one sample only)
(- Electronics: 10-15 (A few in-game samples that I didn't write down.))

Conclusion
- Transindiana and Hakone Maru will never use all available weight, no matter what they load.
- All commonly used ships will normally take textiles, fish, electronics and agricultural products at their full TEU capacity without maxing out on the weight.

Cheers
Olle
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Captain Crunch
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2005 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, all the ships used in this game are actually "real vessels" (I know 'cause I've tried to sell most of them in the course of my job...), and when it comes to container vessels, the vessel will almost never be loaded to a maximum.

This is due to the reason (as stated previously) that the number of TEUs you can employ on a vessel is dependent on weight insted of size (which is the beautiful thing about containers). A 20ft (TEU) can load a max of approx. 28MT, but it is nearly impossible to find a homogenous cargo, wherefore most Owners employ a rule-of-thumb. Normally, the standard is set at 14MT/TEU and with this you will have a lot of empty slots (spaces for containers) if you travel with heavy cargo, and excess capacity in terms of weight if you load light cargo, or empty containers. (The reasoning for empty containers is not important for the game, it is merely for "real life"). Hence, you would have to find a cargo that would match almost perfectly in both senses to fully load your vessel...

Hope the above makes sense... Smile
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Olle P
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 14, 2005 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Captain Crunch wrote:
... Hence, you would have to find a cargo that would match almost perfectly in both senses to fully load your vessel...

Hope the above makes sense... Smile
It makes perfect sense and interesting reading! Smile
However, the original question wasn't about maximising the "fill rate" of the ship, but the cargo value when volume (TEU) or weight is at the limit.
Then you need to know the $/TEU income!

As a side note: I've noticed that Arms are very high density and might be highly profitable ($/ton) as well...

Cheers
Olle
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Bearsie
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 29, 2005 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Basically its a bit tedious as Olle says...
A lot of work with the hand held calculator or load and unload freights to see the results, personally I tend to run out of tonnage before running out of containerspaces, might be my ships.

Regards, Bearsie.
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Captain Crunch
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2005 2:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, this can be quite frustrating to deal with...

However, when chosing your vessel it is important (when dealing with container vessels) that you select the vessel that fits your trade best.

If you operate with heavy cargo (and usually fewer TEUs as this cargo holds higher value/ton), it will be a sound move to invest in a vessel with high dwt capacity and maybe fewer fitted TEUs. This will give you a better utilization of your vessel as you can fill it up with your valuable cargo and then fill up the remaining space (usually lesser weight in bulk or fewer TEUs) to cover your DRCs (Daily Running Costs) and fixed expenses such as mortgages, tugs, canal fees etc. This will enable you to maximise yr profit.

Of course, vice versa can also be applied.

The idea by the above is that you should make sure that your vessel fits your trade. Some of the designs (as these are indeed real ships!) are made for specific purposes, and you should be careful with those unless you wish to perform a specific trade. When deciding on vessels, I prefer to invest in the vessel that allows me the most TEUs on approx
14-20MT/TEU as this will give you a very good all-round vessel.

As for the general discussion (which Ollie corrected me on my first mistake when commenting), I would suggest to chose your cargo on an overall profit margin basis. If this requires more elaboration, let me know... The common discussion between $/ton or $/TEU is highly dependent on your vessel, bunker costs, terminal exp, other fees, penalties, etc. and is not really appropriate for the game in my opinion.

Hope this makes any sense, and is not in too many "business terms" Wink
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